Talk:Anti-tobacco movement in Nazi Germany

Promotion to VGA

Readability

These scores indicate that the article is very close to being in simple English (November 7, 2012). Readability Indices:

• Flesch Kincaid Reading Ease 61 (above 70 would be excellent)
• Flesch Kincaid Grade Level 6.8 (excellent)
• Gunning Fog Score 7.5 (excellent)
• SMOG Index 7
• Coleman Liau Index 11.6
• Automated Readability Index 4.7

--Peterdownunder (talk) 05:29, 7 November 2012 (UTC)

Article based on English Wikipedia

This article or parts of it were created based, in whole or in part, on this version of the English Wikipedia article. The complete history of the article can be found there. --Eptalon (talk) 20:19, 7 June 2021 (UTC)

Undergoing Major Updates

Hello readers. This article is under going some major changes to fix errors and get this up to par since it was created in 2008. This will take me about two days to complete. I ask that no one make any changes, even if it is broken. It is broken because I am working on it and saved it so not to lose my work. Vandalism will be reverted and you will only get 3 warnings before being blocked. Please be nice as this article is being moved to a good article status when complete. Any questions, please let me know. PDL^{Talk to me!}_{OMG, What have I done?} 18:35, 10 June 2021 (UTC)

We don't leave articles in error state just so you can work on it. If you want to work on it without interruption do it in your sandbox. The cite errors were simply a single duplicate reference that needed to be removed. It is now fixed. -Djsasso (talk) 15:56, 11 June 2021 (UTC)

2021 PGA nomination issues

There are at least two issues with this article that must be addressed.

1. Dozens of references rely on Proctor 1999.Proctor, Robert N (1999), "Why did the Nazis have the world's most aggressive anti-cancer campaign?", Endeavour, 23 (2): 76–9, PMID 10451929

The first link is broken. The final link eventually leads us to a firewalled article that one must pay Elsevier to access. We cannot easily verify that any of the statements are supported by Proctor.

2. In "Tobacco policies in Nazi Germany: not as simple as it seems" by Eleonore Bachinger, Martin McKee,* and Anna Gilmore, they claim "While there was considerable opposition to smoking in Nazi Germany, there was no consistent Nazi policy to combat smoking, and what did exist built on pre-existing policies. Although extreme measures were taken in isolated localities or by overzealous party members, there was a marked ambivalence to tobacco control at the highest levels. Many policies were contradictory; measures were often not enforced, and cigarettes were actively distributed to ‘deserving’ groups." Bachinger, et. al. are only cited briefly in the wiki article.

So, we have an article which is unclear in places and the older main source is unavailable. A newer reputable source that is available undercuts the main premise of the article. --Gotanda (talk) 07:46, 27 July 2021 (UTC)

Points to include in revision

I add a couple of thoughts for next time. The title correctly mentions the Nazis because this was the only legitimate period when the Nazi Party was elected to government. The date of the research publication was in the period before WWII. That is significant. Also strange, but true, is that Hitler himself was against smoking.

The Western governments did not come out with the truth about smoking causing emphysema and lung cancer until about the 1960s/1970s. Cigarettes were given free to Allied soldiers during WWII. This was terrible in its consequences for many thousands of men.

There is a sub-text about how few British people could read German, and the question of why the news about this research was not broadcast widely in the West after WWII. Certainly the lack of publicity given in Britain and the U.S.A. to this research is a sizeable blot on their post-war record. Macdonald-ross (talk) 14:17, 23 October 2021 (UTC)

Proposed change of title

• I want to change the title to something like "Anti-tobacco movement in pre-WWII Germany". First, because its roots lie before the Nazi party took control, and because there were for and against camps in Germany as a whole. I'm pretty sure there were similar discussions in some other countries, but as far as I know the link with lung cancer was pinned down first in pre-war Germany. Macdonald-ross (talk) 18:18, 25 October 2021 (UTC)