User talk:Eptalon/Archive 10

Latest comment: 15 years ago by Kennedy in topic Wikibreak

from Zzmonty


I only changed 3 articles from the Sexuality project page (the first 3 on the first column). Maybe one or two on the last column. That is it. So you don't really need to write a bot. You can just manually change things back. Or you could just look up my change history. Excluding things I did in my own area, I have not done that many changes.

Don't automatically remove a category that only has 3 or 5 articles, because it may be a stub category. Zzmonty (talk) 12:26, 2 January 2009 (UTC)Reply

Eptalon, I just did some more testing relating to category names and Vista parental controls. Look on Gwib's talk page for more details. Basically, Vista is too stupid realize that "Male Reproduction" and "Female Reproduction" are part of "Sex Education". When only those categories are listed, the Vista filters don't work. When I added the categories "Sex eduction" or "Vista sex education" the Vista Parental control filters worked. Actually, a person has to specifically select that they want to filter "sex education" websites.
This is the problem. If I make a category "sex education", it would see logical that there should be sub-categories. When that happens, your bot will remove the parent category "sex education" and the parental control filters will no longer work. I could create a special category called "Vista sex education". Then we can just state in that category that it is for parental controls, and not to create sub-categories.
What should we do? Should we create a stand alone category called "Vista sex education" or could you write it an exception for "sex education"? Also, if you already have a bot that looks at categories, would you be able to modify it to add one of the above categories?
I have already posted this question on Gwib's talk page. FYI: I am no longer looking into a any type of ratings, because that is not how the parental control software works. So it would not add a value either to the articles or to parental controls.
My problem is solved. I brought CYBERsitter for $40, and with the custom content filter feature, it is allowing me to have wikipedia function as I desire it to function. Basically, I told the program to filter everything on GWIB's Sexuality project plus a couple of more words he left out. The bottom line is that I am happy that my wikipedia is filtered, and everybody else is happy that their wikipedia is not filtered. Zzmonty (talk) 00:38, 8 January 2009 (UTC)Reply
My problem is not solved. I just left Simple Wikipedia -- threw in the towel. The Wikipedia categories are messed up. This is due to the fact prior to 2004, categories had to be restricted to make sure they did not become too large. In 2004, that code was fixed. Therefore, there is no real reason why an article cannot be in a child and a parent category, and there are very good reason for being in both. I have been doing a lot of research into this matter. This included looking at other classification systems including Universal Decimal Classification, Library of Congress Classification, Dewey Decimal Classification, and even coming up with something new. The main fact that all of these classification systems have and Wikipedia does not have is that any child category has a code at the beginning of it that indicates that parent category. Go to any library shelf and look at the books. The Dewey Decimal number indicates not only the child category, but the parent category as well.
If Wikipedia (or Simple Wikipedia) implemented a code system to indicate parent categories of children categories, it would make is easy to determine the parent category from the child category. Once the category names are cleaned up, third party applications can determine how to filter and to what extent.
You are trying to solve a problem that does not exist at a programming level. But maybe the code that you wrote could be used to tag child categories by their parent category according to some classification standard. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Zzmonty (talkcontribs)

Simple News

Special New Year Edition

39,214 elves, 42,705 reindeer, 112,260 presents.

Annoucements Plans for 2009

  • You can find the wikicup pools here, tomorow! They were chosen randomly by our judge, Bluegoblin7.
  • Happy New Year everyone!

[The Team]

popups malfunction?


Help! My popups seems to be malfunctioning. The quick revert popups tool doesn't seem to be functioning correctly. click here --§ Snake311 (I'm Not Okay!) 20:12, 9 January 2009 (UTC)Reply

You havent been around, I don't know what yours say; I don't have a monobook.js file, but I activated "Navigation popups (API)" in the Gadjets section of my settings. Do you perhaps have the deprecated version (which might clash with Monobook.js)? - If you want, you can get "rollback"..--Eptalon (talk) 20:18, 9 January 2009 (UTC)Reply
Hmm, I've never heard of (or probably forgot) aboutwhat a Navigation popups (API) is. But thanks for the rollback:) --§ Snake311 (I'm Not Okay!) 20:24, 9 January 2009 (UTC)Reply



I left a message for you there, on the talk page. If I don't get a reasonable response, I am deleting it. Once a class-project negates our policies and standards, it fails to be a constructive entity (and don't let me find out that this is a shared account either, or they'll be blocked). We should not get into the habit of approving bad pages for the sake of editors. Synergy 20:52, 9 January 2009 (UTC)Reply



Forgot to leave a message for Creol last night. Since I see you're on, can you de bot me now? Thanks. Synergy 16:02, 11 January 2009 (UTC)Reply



Hi there Eptalon. I have sent you an email. Cheers, Razorflame 22:58, 12 January 2009 (UTC)Reply

I have replied to the email you sent me :). Cheers, Razorflame 00:13, 13 January 2009 (UTC)Reply
Just a question, but did you reply to the email I sent to you last night? Cheers, Razorflame 14:10, 13 January 2009 (UTC)Reply
You sent a mail, which I received 1:11 (my time; GMT+1), I replied 11:00 (my time) ? --Eptalon (talk) 14:15, 13 January 2009 (UTC)Reply
Ok, I got your reply. I will definitely start participating more in areas like WP:ST/WP:PGA/WP:VGA and so on from now on :). Cheers, Razorflame 14:36, 13 January 2009 (UTC)Reply

More email has come your way. Cheers, Razorflame 22:44, 16 January 2009 (UTC)Reply

Just a question, but did you ever reply to that email that I sent to you 4 days ago? Cheers, Razorflame 15:11, 21 January 2009 (UTC)Reply



I have read meta's checkuser policy and the criteria for adminship, but one thing I still do not fully understand is that why are checkusers required to give out identity and be over 18 to become a CU while other users, namely bureaucrats don't undergo the same operation? --§ Snake311 (I'm Not Okay!) 05:37, 13 January 2009 (UTC)Reply

B'crats don't have to deal with the privacy policy which could lead to potential legal issues while CU's do. The protection of personal data is the main reason for the WMF to ensure the identity of all people who have access to that information. --Creol(talk) 07:44, 13 January 2009 (UTC)Reply
CUs have legal obligations as to the confidentiality of the results they see. Legally, it is not possible to make such a contract with someone who is not an adult, in their legislation. Bureaucrats can promote users, and flag bots - nothing that you'd need to be legally adult to do. Crats cannot flag CheckUsers (thats an office action, IIRC). That over here, some of the crats are CUs is a coincidence. --Eptalon (talk) 09:46, 13 January 2009 (UTC)Reply



Did I do ok in the archiving/promoting etc?

Now i'm off to address the issues with Crich Tramway Village and take it back to PGA ;)

Thanks, BG7even 11:40, 13 January 2009 (UTC)Reply

Simple News Issue Three

Simple News
Issue 3 - 19th January 2009

42,058 editors, 53,245 articles, 124,392 pages.

Announcements Administrators

User Articles
Another bumper article from Kennedy this month, with not one, not two, but three pages including Simple News, DYK and RfA
This month Bluegoblin7 writes about the GA and VGA processes
In his second article for Simple News Yotcmdr writes about his new WikiProject, WikiProject France
In a third short article Yotty talks about his opinions of the RFA system

[The Team]

  • The QandA. Every month, Kennedy interviews one of the Simple English Wikipedia's editors, asking them about themselves, and their opinions on Wikipedia. It is an exciting insight behind the anonymous face of an online username. This month is a bumper edition for QandA, as Kennedy was an idiot and forgot to load the interview last edition! This month will be Shapiros10 and Yotcmdr! Click for their interviews:
Shapiros10 Interview
Yotcmdr Interview

The Commander's Choice

The Commanders's Choice. For every edition, Yotcmdr will be chosing articles that need creating, expanding or being attended to. Here is this edition's list:

--GoblinBot3 (talk) 20:45, 19 January 2009 (UTC)Reply



It's time for Nudity to be closed!

I have closed the !voting, but wanted to ask this first: are neutral !votes counted as support, oppose or just not counted at all? I ask because a no-count or support would promote Nudity, an oppose would not.


BG7even 15:42, 20 January 2009 (UTC)Reply

I didnt count it as a vote, but rather a comment; there is no such things as neutral votes. --Eptalon (talk) 16:40, 20 January 2009 (UTC)Reply



You commented at the voting discussion for Wikipedia:Proposed_very_good_articles#Nudity_2. Another user has expressed concerns that there are some sourcing issues with the article that need to be addressed before this is passed as a very good article. Would you mind reviewing the discussion at the vote page and adding your input (or help to find sources, if you can)? Thank you, Either way (talk) 22:00, 20 January 2009 (UTC)Reply

Just to let you know...


...that I reverted this that had been on your userpage for about 30 minutes.


BG7even 10:15, 21 January 2009 (UTC)Reply



I think you misunderstood my intent. I don't want it to seem that admins are not trusted. An example of a use of oversight whereas oversight would *have* to be used is item 3 in the meta oversight policy. I trust the administrators here. Best, NonvocalScream (talk) 00:21, 22 January 2009 (UTC)Reply

Romania PVGA


Hi there Eptalon. I have proposed Romania for VGA status after it got promoted to GA status because I believe that it is well on its' way to becoming a VGA. However, I am unsure about what needs to be done on the article because nobody seems to have given any hint as to what needs to be done to make Romania a VGA. Do you think that you could provide some much needed information as to what needs fixing or needs to be done to make Romania a Very Good Article? Thanks, Razorflame 18:57, 23 January 2009 (UTC)Reply



Since the page I reference has you as the author (and there may be more authors, I did not check all pages)... could you take a look at this section of AN. If you know anything that might help me fix the issue, please comment there. As soon as we fix the source issue, I'll have a bot go over and fix the subst'ed messages. Cheers! NonvocalScream (talk) 16:56, 24 January 2009 (UTC)Reply

I need your input if possible. :) Kind regards, NonvocalScream (talk) 23:12, 25 January 2009 (UTC)Reply

I'm confused?


Can somebody please explain to me what the heck is going on? Before this issue popped up, the idea was "Adminship was no big deal". Now that I have returned, things are starting to change by the minute and people are taking adminship personally. --§ Snake311 (I'm Not Okay!) 08:20, 26 January 2009 (UTC)Reply

Simple talk note


Hi there Eptalon. As we discussed yesterday on the IRC, I have posted a note about all three of our article processes on Wikipedia:Simple Talk to try to add more activity to the GA/VGA/Demotion parts of the Simple English Wikipedia. I would appreciate it if you would chime in there and add your little bit to the post that I wrote to encourage more participation in those areas. Cheers, Razorflame 18:51, 26 January 2009 (UTC)Reply

Passion music


Hi Eptalon. Can I refer you to my comment on the discussion page of Passion cantata. Any comment? Cheers.Hikitsurisan (talk) 20:49, 31 January 2009 (UTC)Reply


  The Copyeditor's Barnstar
I Yotcmdr award you this barnstar for your outstanding correction/translation of my text in german. It's great. Next task, Bastide to VGA! Yotcmdr =talk to the commander= 23:18, 5 February 2009 (UTC)Reply

Requests for checkusership/Vector


Hi there Eptalon. Vector's RfCU should have been closed yesterday. Could you go and close it? Thanks, Razorflame 21:36, 6 February 2009 (UTC)Reply

Changing username


Hi! Would you like to take a look at my username change request at Wikipedia:Changing username? Thanks, Leo Johannes (talk) 09:31, 7 February 2009 (UTC)Reply



Hi eptalon. Could you make a short list of things that need doing on the article so I can get cracking! Thanks, Yotcmdr =talk to the commander= 16:40, 9 February 2009 (UTC)Reply



I appreciate you taking the time to look at both sides of the story, and I appreciate your comments and realize any mistakes I have made. It made me think there are better ways to solve a problem, and to step back and be careful of inflaming the situation. I hope I can make some valuable contributions to Wik Sim/Eng. To let you know alot of my mistakes from Wik Eng, were from my not knowing the rules, I had friends help me edit a number of articles I created and b/c the edits were from the same ip, it gave the appearance of something called "sock-puppetry"..I did not know what this was until being accused of it, and things went downhill from there :O) I appreciate the helpful attitude of people around here. Eastvillagegroupie (talk) 15:20, 14 February 2009 (UTC)Reply

You are welcome, as I say, there is enough work to do here, and we are not punishing people for things they did elesewhere. --Eptalon (talk) 15:33, 14 February 2009 (UTC)Reply

One more thing


thanks for all your help, could you also delete links PR has posted up? I feel that they invade my privacy. I would appreciate if you could do this.

Eastvillagegroupie (talk) 19:01, 14 February 2009 (UTC)Reply

This behavior pattern is very similar to what she did on Remember, she connected Eastvillagegroupie to the Tweety21 en-account before I posted any links, she connected herself to other IPs through her editing on, and now she's complaining about her privacy being invaded. I do worry that it will escalate yet again. Precious Roy (talk) 21:03, 14 February 2009 (UTC)Reply

This is ridiculous


lets leave the past in the past, one last time! move on! seriously dude! done! fini! Eastvillagegroupie (talk) 21:17, 14 February 2009 (UTC)Reply

You're right, it is ridiculous—you're the one who brought all this up in the first place and now you're complaining about it. I said it before and I'll say it again: I am not trying to stop you from editing on Period. I only want you to follow the rules.
Stop complaining about the links that are on here now—you connected Eastvillagegroupie to Tweety21 first, not me. Nobody cares about it as long as you aren't disruptive here on simple. Just let it go and realize that you (once again) have linked yourself to Tweety21. Let it pass and a few links to won't be a big deal. Precious Roy (talk) 21:27, 14 February 2009 (UTC)Reply

Block of


You blocked for 6 months. Other than those two nonsense pages, his/her edits seem to be good faith. Is the IP related to a vandal or banned user?--≈  Fairfield  χ  19:21, 15 February 2009 (UTC)Reply

It looked familiar (Mummy green or bald; I therefore concluded it was a spambot); I may have been wrong though.--Eptalon (talk) 20:48, 15 February 2009 (UTC)Reply

defining simple


It seems to me that we agree that one thing needed to keep this WP running is to reach some workable definition of Simple, and help people to stick to it. I'll quote your last comment on a thread archived from the talk page:

(<-) TV/Movie, Gutenberg, Contemporary fiction, take 5k words each; gives you 15k words worst case, clean for duplicates, and proper names (first names, place names); we will probably be left with something between 5 and 7.5k words. Take the first half of these (2.5k-4k) and we will probably have a good list. --Eptalon (talk) 11:51, 9 February 2009 (UTC)

I have another proposal:

  • The 1000 words of the kernel Ogden Basic. Required by all dialects of Basic.
  • The 1000 Fry Instant Words. Recommended to all native readers.
  • The 1000 words required by all wiktionaries. All users have access to these definitions.
  • The mixed vocabularies of Special/ized English (VOA&FEBA: 1750 words). They provide working examples of "Simple English" for regular broadcasting.

If we provide a spellchecker for some Browsers to potential editors, all "nonsimple" words will be underlined in red, and users may act accordingly. I may send to you the sample list, if you ask me to. Lwyx (talk) 19:30, 15 February 2009 (UTC)Reply

Hello there. First off: I am not a linguist, I am also not a native English speaker. We can of course always discuss how many words we take, but here is the rationale behind the choices:
  • English as a language is very present in the media. It is probably very easy to get CNN or other English-speaking TV channels; also Hollywood/Bollywood produce many movies in English (India has 23 official Indic languages, plus English). Therefore taking a wordlist that reflects TV/movie scripts is probably a good idea
  • The contemporary fiction reflects the "English-language" books of today (e.g. John Grisham). Such books are often available at airports and probably easy to get hold of.
  • Gutenberg represents the "literature" category; Books read at school (eg. William Golding) will probably fall into this category.
Please note that I expect these lists to overlap pretty much (That is: I would be surprised to get more than like "7.5k-8k" words when taking 5k words from each of the 3 wordlists).
Some other observations:
  • I don't claim my wordlists are the best choice; as I said, I am neither a linguist, not involved in language-teaching.
  • My approach is open: the basic idea is: take a number of words from wordlists that the "target" audience is most likely familiar with; its also open in that we can freely chose the wordlists, and number of words from each.
  • I did a Cambridge Cert. of Proficiency: Is there a way we can account for the fact that the English in India is noticeably different form that in South Africa, or that in Belize?
  • The basic idea: the words from the "resulting wordlist" do not need linking, as we can expect our audience to know them. All other vocabulary is fine as well, but the words used need explaining either in the article, or as linked explanation.
  • Our "wordlist" should probably be around 4-5k words.--Eptalon (talk) 21:16, 15 February 2009 (UTC)Reply
  • I concede most of the points you make. I'm not a native speaker either, but my experience in mentoring students of ESL (I teach phil for a living, but mentoring is part of my workload) is that the average intermediate reader has a vocabulary of around 2000-2500 words. That's the reading level of the Longman Simplified Series. That's why I thought about shooting for a slightly lower reading level. One advantage of these sources (Ogden, Fry, Special/ized) is that there are external resources for these word lists, so they're not "original research", so to say. In fact, Fry is recommended for the classroom and reading tests for native readers, and VOA and FEBA follow the kind of strategy you propose for ESL students: provide an online dictionary for their vocabularies, and explain on the run the newly introduced words. Links to the dictionary are even more practical on wikiprojects.--- On the other hand, I must say that writing for this lower level is extremely difficult---almost painful :-) Lwyx (talk) 00:04, 17 February 2009 (UTC)Reply
Your "wordlist" gets to a 4750 words, at best; I have no idea, but i think we will have 50% or more overlap (which means between 2k and 2.5k words, for your approach). If we fill the remainder to the 5k words (meaning 2.5k ), we could take 1000 words each from the lists I proposed. Also such a project would be ideal to collaborate with Simple English Wiktionary (making sure the words we have in the wordlist are in fact all in SEWikt).--Eptalon (talk) 08:45, 17 February 2009 (UTC)Reply
I'll join in the discussion as you know that readability is one of my main interests - I thought about combining word lists to see what would happen. I have experimented with the "A"s. I put together the Ogden 850, with the combined list, the VOA list, and the 1000 words from modern books. Have a look at the result here User:Peterdownunder/wordlist. Having done it I'm not totally convinced that it is going to help. If the word lists get too big we may lose the simple english. I think we do need to do something, so of the recent comments are valid. Should we get the discussion onto the Simple talk pages, or do we need a separate discussion page to talk through the issues ?--Peterdownunder (talk) 09:37, 17 February 2009 (UTC)Reply
Moved to Simple talk--Eptalon (talk) 10:33, 17 February 2009 (UTC)Reply

Hello Eptalon


I made some minor mods to Scientology and Church of Scientology. I hope we can work together. Terryeo (talk) 14:50, 18 February 2009 (UTC)Reply

You were right


You were right about how the xcbd comic has actually been a blessing in disguise. I am surprised at the amount of work that has been gotten done around here on this site. It was definitely a good thing to get the exposure that we did :). Razorflame 14:46, 24 February 2009 (UTC)Reply



(Block log); 13:56 . . Eptalon (Talk | changes) blocked (Talk) with an expiry time of indefinite (anonymous users only, account creation disabled, autoblock disabled) (Bad behaviour/harassment)

No, you never block IPs indefinitely. *sigh*. Razorflame 20:01, 26 February 2009 (UTC)Reply

He's right.-- † CM16 t c r 20:04, 26 February 2009 (UTC)Reply
Note: I have reset the block for 1 month. Two changes made don't warrent a long-term block, anyway. But still, a block is needed. TheAE talk 20:11, 26 February 2009 (UTC)Reply
Ok, sorry..--Eptalon (talk) 20:20, 26 February 2009 (UTC)Reply

Since you appear to be online


Could you please block Fwalsh26 (talk • contribs • CA • deleted contribs • nuke contribs • logs • filter log • block user • block log) for me? Thanks --Chris 08:32, 27 February 2009 (UTC)Reply

He's a sock of Fwalsh25 (talk • contribs • CA • deleted contribs • nuke contribs • logs • filter log • block user • block log) btw --Chris 08:35, 27 February 2009 (UTC)Reply
Could you also delete User:Mentifisto/revert.js please? Templates don't seem to work on such pages. -- Mentifisto 13:42, 27 February 2009 (UTC)Reply
  Done--Eptalon (talk) 13:44, 27 February 2009 (UTC)Reply



Hello Eptalon, please can You rename this account to something else, it is blocking the sul account of the true user and has no edits, apparently he either lost his password or someone else registered that name because he is not able to merge it, since it has 0 edits a rename would be uncontroversial but solve this issue, many thanks in advance, best regards, --Spacebirdy (talk) 18:59, 28 February 2009 (UTC)Reply

  Done (now called "Jimbo Wales renamed" (I know I am inventive)--Eptalon (talk) 23:24, 28 February 2009 (UTC)Reply
Kind thanks, --Spacebirdy (talk) 10:02, 1 March 2009 (UTC)Reply


  The Barnstar of Diligence
For all that you do here, I hereby award you this barnstar! Razorflame 03:49, 2 March 2009 (UTC)Reply
  Congratulations: You have been given a Barnstar!

For all of your hard work here, I hereby award you this barnstar! Razorflame 03:49, 2 March 2009 (UTC))Reply

  Congratulations: You have been given a Barnstar!

For your work on the Main Page VGA rotation system. Chenzw  Talk  11:41, 2 March 2009 (UTC)Reply

Would we block this UA?


Hiya, would this UA be one we would block due to bad username? (2010AudiR8V10 (talk · contribs)) Cheers fr33kman talk 18:22, 2 March 2009 (UTC)Reply

Is it likely to offend feelings, or convey adverising? - then yes? --Eptalon (talk) 20:31, 2 March 2009 (UTC)Reply
Convey advertising, yes. I'll block it. Thanks (always like to double-check :-) ) fr33kman talk 20:34, 2 March 2009 (UTC)Reply
Could you check the settings for me? I want to make sure I used the right settings. fr33kman talk 20:38, 2 March 2009 (UTC)Reply
For bad username it is usually: block login, allow talk page editing, sending mail, account creation; and don't block the last IP the user used --Eptalon (talk) 20:41, 2 March 2009 (UTC)Reply
Yes, I was just going to say this. We don't hardblock bad user names unless it's clear they're making the user names to be disruptive. Either way (talk) 20:43, 2 March 2009 (UTC)Reply
Thanks, I had concerns about having done it correctly. Learning! :) fr33kman talk 20:45, 2 March 2009 (UTC)Reply
Think I've fixed it now, and unblocked the autoblocked IP address fr33kman talk 20:51, 2 March 2009 (UTC)Reply

Simple News Issue Three

Simple News
Issue 4 - 2th March 2009

50,065 editors, 55,989 articles, 130,886 pages.

Announcements Administrators

  • Happy Birthday to Shapiros10 who celebrates his birthday today! Party at his place later!
  • The Simple English Wikipedia now has:
  • 1,421,733 changes have been made since the Simple English Wikipedia started. This comes to 11.15 'changes per page' in the project.

User Articles
Another article from Kennedy including writing about Simple News, P(V)GA's and some blatant spam!
This month Bluegoblin7 revisits the current situation at the DYK process.
A piece this month from Yotcmdr about a simplification project.
In his debut article for Simple News, Razorflame writes about the recent increase in Vandalism
Shapiros10 writes about Simple's recent turmoil for his debut article.

[The Team]





  • The QandA. Every month, Kennedy interviews one of the Simple English Wikipedia's editors, asking them about themselves, and their opinions on Wikipedia. It is an exciting insight behind the anonymous face of an online username.

This weeks interviews are with Bluegoblin7 and Kennedy! Yotcmdr and BG7 took the interviews.
Click for Bluegoblin7's interview!
Click for Kennedy's interview!

The Commander's Choice

The Commanders's Choice. For every edition, Yotcmdr will be chosing articles that need creating, expanding or being attended to. Here is this edition's list:

--GoblinBot3 (talk) 22:08, 2 March 2009 (UTC)Reply



Hi, do I just block the puppeteer now that it's confirmed or hold a ban discussion? It's my first sockpuppet :) fr33kman talk 00:05, 4 March 2009 (UTC)Reply

This is just my opinion: Sockpuppetry per se is not bad (and not outlawed); and the "did not simplify an article they created" is a very weak thing to ban someone (for sockpuppetry). So, to extract yourself from the sling, you could try talking to that user; and talking to the community - to find a way to actually get a working solution...--Eptalon (talk) 00:09, 4 March 2009 (UTC)Reply
Okay, I'm willing to do that, but this is all based on them being banned indef at enWP for using multiple accounts and ignoring requests to stop and be part of the community. They were banned there by community consensus. Thoughts? fr33kman talk 00:15, 4 March 2009 (UTC)Reply

(<-) Don't judge users by what they did elsewhere; I know of two people (one of them is an admin) that were/are banned at EnWP. Unless you find something to actually ban the user for here, I guess you need to consider unbanning. --Eptalon (talk) 00:20, 4 March 2009 (UTC)Reply

You mean unban the second account? fr33kman talk 00:25, 4 March 2009 (UTC)Reply
I have unbanned the account. I personally think that the user will earn a ban here too; but I won't judge on enWP stuff then. I have also put their user pages back to the way they were originally. Cheers fr33kman talk 00:40, 4 March 2009 (UTC)Reply
Can you also put a short note on their page, perhaps explaining, and apologizing? ;) --Eptalon (talk) 08:59, 4 March 2009 (UTC)Reply
I don't feel an apology is warranted. I could have exercised the right of an admin to simply block a user banned at another WMF site as explained in WP:BLOCK. I have chosen not to. The user has been very disruptive at enWP, have committed GFDL infractions here, has created another user account that I feel was intended to use for sock-puppetry (which he has now asked to be deleted). The user vandalised at enWP, created a couple of dozen sock-puppets and said they were not him. I don't see where an apology is warranted, I really don't fr33kman talk 16:08, 4 March 2009 (UTC)Reply



Hello Eptalon. I saw you made the article called Algorithm. I wrote on the talk page. Will you please look? Teenly 21:20, 5 March 2009 (UTC)Reply

I am sorry I did not answer until now. There was a lineup yesterday so I could not get the computer. Thank you thank you for the Barnstar! I have seen them before but I did not think I would have my own! I wrote something on the talk page. Teenly 21:53, 7 March 2009 (UTC)Reply

I saw you changed the Bubble sort algorithm to put a flag in. That is what I was thinking about. If you have time, I wrote something on my Algorithm page where you left me a note on Wednesday. It is after the yellow part. Teenly 23:24, 13 March 2009 (UTC)Reply

Happy Eptalon's Day!


Eptalon has been identified as an Awesome Wikipedian,
and therefore, I've officially declared today as Eptalon's day!
For being such a great wikipedian and kind person,
enjoy being the Star of the day, dear Eptalon!

Cheers, Fairfield Deleted? 00:01, 8 March 2009 (UTC)Reply

A record of your Day will always be kept here.

World History


Hi there Eptalon. I decided to take a stab at copyediting World History. I managed to copyedit a few of the sections, but the article is just too bloody long for me to copyedit the whole thing. I would recommend that you take a second look at the article and make links to wiktionary and look for other minor errors.

Also, read its' talk page, because I left a question there. Cheers, Razorflame 13:33, 10 March 2009 (UTC)Reply

That article is possibly the longest we have overall, so I fully understand you. Look at my edits, most of the time, the cleanup/extension is only like one section. --Eptalon (talk) 13:35, 10 March 2009 (UTC)Reply
:P It isn't a problem, though :). Cheers, Razorflame 13:37, 10 March 2009 (UTC)Reply



Hi Eptalon. I know you´re a busy guy but I´d appreciate your input on the MOS discussion I have initiated on Simple Talk. Cheers. The Rambling Man on tour (talk) 18:43, 11 March 2009 (UTC)Reply

Today's user ratings


Congratulations, Eptalon! You've received a rating of 4.5 stars today for your work on the Simple English Wikipedia! See User:Razorflame/Today's user ratings for more information!

Bastide (2)


DOesn't look so good after all. Sorry, I've not been on, I had my german echange partner here ;) Yotcmdr =talk to the commander= 06:18, 13 March 2009 (UTC)Reply

Administrative transfer...?


Hi! I'm already an admin at the English Wikipedia and a bureaucrat at Wikia's Radio Control Wiki. Can the admin rights be rolled over to this account as well? Looks like this site gets just as hammered by vandalism as does English, if not worse. --PMDrive1061 (talk) 15:51, 13 March 2009 (UTC)Reply

Thanks. I'd appreciate that. It'll certainly make things easier. I have a lot of ideas for new articles as well; I'll bring a few of my originals from English over here and tweak the language to fit the site. Thanks again for the offer and the welcome! I look forward to helping out. --PMDrive1061 (talk) 16:01, 13 March 2009 (UTC)Reply

PS: Gotta run, but if you do grant me the rollback rights, please leave word on my talk page and I'll start hitting the recent changes patrolling right away. Regards, --PMDrive1061 (talk) 16:02, 13 March 2009 (UTC)Reply

Thanks! I'll get to work right away. --PMDrive1061 (talk) 23:02, 13 March 2009 (UTC)Reply

copying from en:Wikipedia


Sometimes I copy stuff from en:Wikipedia to Simple English Wikipedia. Later, I edit the page to simplify it.

Is that what you did at the computer article [1]?

When you do that, please write in your edit summary where you copied the work from. See Wikipedia:Copyrights#Moving things from other Wikipedias for details.

Thank you. --DavidCary (talk) 04:45, 15 March 2009 (UTC)Reply

Riemann Hypothesis


Ach, I certainly did not mean to get into an edit war there. I sincerely apologise. Out of curiosity, what is generally the more accepted format here; simple but a stub, or informative but complex? FrancesO (talk) 00:30, 16 March 2009 (UTC)Reply

As I thought. Thank you. FrancesO (talk) 00:36, 16 March 2009 (UTC)Reply
Have suggested a merge as help towards completing this article. Would appreciate your input :) FrancesO (talk) 01:38, 16 March 2009 (UTC)Reply

Simple News Issue Five

Simple News
Issue 5 - 16th March 2009

52,806 editors, 56,607 articles, 133,001 pages.

Announcements Administrators

User Articles
In his debut article, DefenseSupportParty talks about the spoken articles project and what it means to them
In his second article, Razorflame explores the big world of article writing.
For his fifth article, Yotcmdr also speaks about the Spoken articles project... and you can even listen to this one!

[The Team]

  • The QandA. Every month, Kennedy interviews one of the Simple English Wikipedia's editors, asking them about themselves, and their opinions on Wikipedia. It is an exciting insight behind the anonymous face of an online username.

This weeks interview is with Eptalon
Click for Eptalon's interview!

The Commander's Choice

The Commanders's Choice. For every edition, Yotcmdr will be chosing articles that need creating, expanding or being attended to. Here is this edition's list:

--GoblinBot3 (talk) 12:44, 16 March 2009 (UTC)Reply



Hey Eptalon,

I just demoted Timpani per the request for demotion and was just checking that I hadn't missed anything out with the new system!


Goblin 18:18, 20 March 2009 (UTC)Reply


  Bubblycanuck has given you some cookies! Now enjoy them!

Bubblycanuck (talk

I mentioned you...


Hi Eptalon. Following yesterday's joyous G12 encounters, I've started a centralised discussion on this so new and old editors alike can be made more aware of this issue. It's on WP:ST, and it'd be good to hear your input. Cheers, The Rambling Man (talk) 10:10, 29 March 2009 (UTC)Reply

Wikipedia:List of Wikipedians by number of edits


Hi! aka hat erstmal abgesagt. Und ich habe deine deutsche Rechtschreibung auf deiner de.WP page leicht ans deutsche angepasst. Gruß, Barras (talk) 09:32, 30 March 2009 (UTC)Reply

Quick revert to last good version


Hi there, we were both trying to fix the Mugabe page at the same time, but you were quicker than me. What is the quick way to do it when you can't use rollback? Do I use this undo above the last good edit?--Peterdownunder (talk) 09:57, 2 April 2009 (UTC)Reply

I saw a bot edit, and a number of IP edits; so I basically assumed that all the subsequent IP edits after the bot were bad ones (maybe even same user playing good guy/bad guy). What we can do now is check whether any of tzhe IPs actually added something. o, blocking the IP is not an option any more, IPs change, and that edit was like a week back. --Eptalon (talk) 10:02, 2 April 2009 (UTC)Reply
The IP edits were all vandalism.--Peterdownunder (talk) 10:09, 2 April 2009 (UTC)Reply

Re:Roll back


Thank you for granting me roll back. :] Papercutbiology♫ (talk)) 16:09, 2 April 2009 (UTC)Reply

Crat cat


Hi Eptalon. I've just made Category:Wikipedia bureaucrats - perhaps you'd like to add yourself? Should be a useful category for folks seeking out a 'crat. The Rambling Man (talk) 18:33, 2 April 2009 (UTC)Reply



Hey Eptalon,

Just a friendly reminder that TRM's RfCU needs closing 17 hours ago :).


BG7THAT'S NUMBERWANG! 10:03, 3 April 2009 (UTC)Reply

You've archived it. Now what? The Rambling Man (talk) 10:51, 3 April 2009 (UTC)Reply
I am writing a longer comment, as closing crat... be patient... :) --Eptalon (talk) 10:55, 3 April 2009 (UTC)Reply
Have been for 17 hours....! The Rambling Man (talk) 11:06, 3 April 2009 (UTC)Reply

Contents of Themis Music Talk Page


Thanks for putting that on my talk page. That seems fairer! Hell. I don't want to do this wrongly. I think I have a valid article. :o) I may well be approaching it in the wrong category. The notability of this article has to do with the rapidly growing Wicca religion having a public entity advancing its beliefs. This is new for Wicca. Maybe I have titled the article wrongly. People keep bashing this issue around but the debate has centred on a musical band and not the fact that there is a music project done by some Wicca priests which significantly advances the concept of Wicca and gives Wicca greater notability and acceptance. We are talking about a religion wherein women who practiced homeopathy and herbal remedies were burned at the stake. Today a musical ensemble promotes Wicca openly for what it is: a nature based pagan religion. That's notable. There are no Wiccan Churches, Popes, Annual General Meetings; Ecclesiastical Conferences but there is a Music Band that promotes Wicca openly, widely, and in many different ways. Thanks again. Katie alsop (talk) 17:15, 7 April 2009 (UTC)Reply

Have you ever tried the other way round, e.g. writing an article about Wicca music, and then mentioning that there are a few bands that spread the "message"; I konw a few bands from germany who claim to be pagan. You should probably also extend our Wicca article; what might be wrong as an article of its own might be perfectly fine in a section on Wiccan music (in Wicca). We are not against paganism/wicca, we are against content that is on the brink of notability. --Eptalon (talk) 17:21, 7 April 2009 (UTC)Reply
Oh, just as a side note, I contributed a lot to witch and witchcraft articles, I know what you are talking about. --Eptalon (talk) 17:33, 7 April 2009 (UTC)Reply
Thanks. The Wicca Music article is already written. The Themis Band article should be notable by the standards because it is a band that plays at major national concerts (in Canada) and it is on the playlist of notable radio stations. I see that the Category really is the issue. Using the "music template" for example creates tensions and jealousies among other musicians and I guess might open a pandora's box. For example, MySpace was once a social networking forum and has now become a "pimp-my-band" whore house. Nobody wants that for Wikipedia. Katie alsop (talk) 03:15, 8 April 2009 (UTC)Reply
a few bands from germany who claim to be pagan is about the sum of it all. Thanks for that thought. I have seen as much. There aren't many purely "Wicca" bands. There is only one actually. Chalice and Blade comes close by their own admission but has mostly a broad pagan focus. Another thought about the modern movement's intellectuals is that they exist in a time post stem cell discovery whereas most people talking about Wicca on Wikipedia are speaking of it as if it is still in the era shortly after discovery of the wheel, and fire. If you are looking for an end to a patriarchal society (include Wikipedia) and saving the rain forest, join the modern (Themis-brand) Wicca movement. Remember that 'Themis' (the Goddess) was about balance and justice, putting the mother at the head of the famly and seeking a gender equality in life with justice, nurturing and mourishing for the "onesness" of all sentient beings. Clearly people working on these articles are on a different wavelength from the people who shred it who still think its about ego and a musical band, witches and witchcraft. To do otherwise is to admit a competitor for Christianity. I have seen a certain component of that. Be that as it may be I need help. I am sure I have approached it all wrong. I just need to keep trying. :o) Katie alsop (talk) 15:49, 12 April 2009 (UTC)Reply
What people call religion is to some extent about belief - No matter what religion you take, at some point the scientifically provable part will end, and you will be asked to subscribe to some form of believing something that cannot be proved by science. Wicca probably is a movement rooted in neo-paganism - it wants to go back to have stronger ties with nature. It probably bears little resemblance to what the witches did, and what they were burnt at the stake for. Personally, I am not looking at the end of a patriarchal society. There are times where decisions need to be taken, and the person taking the decision needs to have an authority to impose certain rules to be followed, without question. Whether the decision-taker is male or female is irrelevant. Men are physically stronger, so they often have had an easier time "convincing" others. What we were talking about here was a "music band" who through their music spread a certain message. The message may be more important than its carrier. Something else that may be important is the sex-appeal. If some rituals involve nude intoxicated young people dancing around a fire this may be an enticing thought. I guess this all boils down how you sell your idea to those people, who are used to (more-or-less) large crowds of more-or-less elderly people you find in the classical Christian Churches (which are probably the norm in most of the US and Europe). --Eptalon (talk) 16:11, 12 April 2009 (UTC)Reply



Hey Eptalon. I've gone through about 2/3 of the article and linked complex words, simplified prose where possible, and removed really in-depth material that probably isn't needed on this Wikipedia. How are we doing? The Rambling Man (talk) 20:54, 8 April 2009 (UTC)Reply

Good job simplifying!! - Can the article be extended (compare to the English one which is a lot more complex). Can we justify removing the complex tag? --Eptalon (talk) 21:07, 8 April 2009 (UTC)Reply
I feel happy that it's not complex any longer. However, yes, it can be expanded. Do you want to bring some detail (and citations) over, and I'll copyedit, simplify and rework references? The Rambling Man (talk) 21:08, 8 April 2009 (UTC)Reply
If you look at the EnWP article what would be the next sections that would be good to bring over here, in your opiono? - After all we want to spare the reader all the gory details enwp has... --Eptalon (talk) 21:13, 8 April 2009 (UTC)Reply
Don't forget we don't need to eliminate red links for GA. For me, what's left is a "treatment" section. Add that and I think we're close enough for a half-decent Simple GA. The Rambling Man (talk) 21:32, 8 April 2009 (UTC)Reply



You have an RFA to close. :P (Asking for BG7) Meetare Shappy Cunkelfratz! 22:50, 10 April 2009 (UTC)Reply

I believe Shappy's right =). Good luck closing, Yotcmdr =talk to the commander= 22:54, 10 April 2009 (UTC)Reply

Recent changes


Eptalon. You overruled everyone by changing the Recent Changes template to include an article which has precisely zero links, instantly making it an orphan when created. At least the Falklands War had half a dozen pages pointing at it. I'm not into revert wars but really, this needs wholesale address. What actually is most wanted here? The Rambling Man (talk) 17:32, 11 April 2009 (UTC)Reply

Color Blindness


I left issues (of the writing sort) on the talk page, and I wanted you to correct them as you are more knowledgeable of the subject. I just posted here to make it clear that I have not corrected them, but I will if you want me to.  Mm40(talk | contribs)  17:49, 11 April 2009 (UTC)Reply

Please don't misunderstand me, I am not knowledgeable about the subject at all; I basically copyedited/simplified stuff from other Wikipedias; As I have written on the GA proposals page, I have pretty much done everything for that article I can. So feel free and go ahead. --Eptalon (talk) 20:40, 11 April 2009 (UTC)Reply



Thank you protecting Teenly's User page, for giving her a Barnstar (she was very excited about that) and for taking the time to help her understand the "Algorithm" article. Her Teenly/Algorithm and Teenly/Sort pages show how hard she always tried to understand. Despite her exceptional intelligence she was never proud. She was such a good-hearted child, she saw everyone as her friend, and as a result most people were.

On her talk page you wrote that she died on the 10th of April. It was actually just before midnight on the night of April 6-7. I have corrected this. Fenneck (talk) 23:13, 11 April 2009 (UTC)Reply

I think that no one in their right mind would vandalise a page of a user who died (it is just against piety, religious feelings, no matter what your religion happens to be), but I want to avoid hurting feelings, so I fully protected the page.
As to the barnstar, she really deserved it. The algorithm was there unchanged since 2005 - no one tried it. She did, and found out it did not work as expected. She might have been a child, but I suppose many adults also read that page - They did not try and and hence did not find the error (which I also did not know existed, btw). In my opinion she really deserved that barnstar for finding the error. That's how development happens in real life too, btw - you find that something does not work as expected, and fix it so it does...--Eptalon (talk) 23:23, 11 April 2009 (UTC)Reply



Could you speedily delete Tulisa? Thanks. No admins are on IRC, so I had to bug you here.  Mm40 (talk | contribs)  12:22, 14 April 2009 (UTC)Reply



dear Eptalon,

I read what you write to me and I'm so sad, becouse what I've done is too wrong and now I'm conscious.
I' ll never do the same thing or similar again. You are in right Admins and Bureaucrats are a team and I've done a big error. Sorry for the late reply but this week end I have connections problems with my pc. I like this project and I don't wont to damage again and I want to became more active as user and admin. I'm so sorry for the fact.
--vector ^_^ (talk) 14:19, 20 April 2009 (UTC)Reply

No problems. ;) --vector ^_^ (talk) 18:52, 20 April 2009 (UTC)Reply


I would like to create this template, can you help me? --vector ^_^ (talk) 12:30, 21 April 2009 (UTC)Reply

Genocides of the 21th century


Nice hand there; you deleted that article before I had a chance to QD tag it! --Dylan620 (Sign this plz) 12:22, 23 April 2009 (UTC)Reply

Bot Flag


I have just been going through the list of Bots on the wiki and I noticed that User:Betacommand still has a bot flag on him which I believe you gave so he wouldn't flood the RC list. He hasn't edited since Mar 11th so he probably doesn't need it anymore, so perhaps you could remove it? -Djsasso (talk) 16:50, 23 April 2009 (UTC)Reply

Sremska mitrovica


Depends, what do you think if you say track of, but there are: Sremska Mitrovica and Kosovska Mitrovica, no more Mitrovicas...^_^

Note: If category of article witch you writing is in Category:Serbia, stub for that article is {{serbia}}, no just {{stub}}, how were before (  This short article about Serbia can be made longer. You can help Wikipedia by adding to it. )

Regards, --AleksA 15:05, 24 April 2009 (UTC)Reply

Simple News Issue 6

Simple News
Issue 6 - 28th April 2009

60,218 editors, 58,333 articles, 138,873 pages.

Announcements Administrators

User Articles
Kennedy urges you for your help to keep Simple News alive in his fifth article.
For his sixth article, Yotcmdr speaks about P(V)GA, DYK, SN and Spoken articles.
In his debut article, EhJJ writes about the CC license and the impact of a possible change of copyright policy on the Simple English Wikipedia.
Shappy talks about the growth of Simple, and its contrast from EN, in his second articls for Simple News.

[The Team]

  • There is a discussion on-going on whether or not to remove the tools of eight admins. Please comment there to have your say!

  • The QandA. Every month, Kennedy interviews one of the Simple English Wikipedia's editors, asking them about themselves, and their opinions on Wikipedia. It is an exciting insight behind the anonymous face of an online username.

This weeks interview is with Steve Crossin and was taken by guest interviewer Bluegoblin7.
Click for Steve's interview!

The Commander's Choice

The Commanders's Choice. For every edition, Yotcmdr will be chosing articles that need creating, expanding or being attended to. Here is this edition's list (which are mostly P(V)GA:

GoblinBot3 (talk) 18:34, 28 April 2009 (UTC)Reply



Hey Eptalon. I think you should, for the time being, attribute new articles you create, such as Cotton mouse to their equivalent, on the talk page using the enwp-based template. There's no doubt you based it on, using the same infobox, and even an image which isn't accessible here on simple. Until we get the GFDL requirements clearly defined, we might as well cover ourselves 100%. The Rambling Man (talk) 19:46, 29 April 2009 (UTC)Reply

Ok, attributed. FYI: that image is us-government, so I uploaded it at commmons. --Eptalon (talk) 19:52, 29 April 2009 (UTC)Reply



I hereby bestow upon you a slightly-customised user talk page. Enjoy :P MC8 (b · t) 18:52, Sunday May 3 2009 (UTC)

Kitzmiller v. Dover Area School District


Hi Eptalon. Looking at the references for this, it appears most of them are pointed at Wikisource. I'm not sure this is good enough, using another Wiki as a reliable source. I would think we should mandate the use of the actual source that Wikisource is using. What do you think? The Rambling Man (talk) 14:35, 4 May 2009 (UTC)Reply

I have thought about this, and my conclusions are: Wikisource is probably good enough. This is about a court case, what you find in wikisource are the proceedings. I do not know the situation in the US, but over here, they would also be published "by the resp. court who took the decision". There might be problems though:
  • Very often, the proceedings are published as PDF files. This requires a PDF reader. I agree that PDF is perhaps the most common format out there to publish documents, and PDF readers both from Adobe, and more-or-less free alternatives are readily available. As a contrast, Wikisource documents are rendered in html and do not need such a reader. A way out of this might be to get a link to the original source, and specify that the document is also available in wikisource. In other words: the benefit of Wikisource is that it does not need additional software, the drawback is that as a wiki it may not be totally reliable.
  • Sometimes getting the original court documents requires the user to log in. In that case, Wikisource is preferable.
  • There may be different versions: Do we want the original proceedings, or given that we (at least I) are not lawyers some commented version? (Which might qualify as secondary source)?
What I pointed out is of course also valid for other sources, like scientific articles: Free sources (that do not require a login) are preferable to others. --Eptalon (talk) 07:46, 5 May 2009 (UTC)Reply


Hello, Eptalon. You have new messages at Wikipedia:Requests for deletion/Requests/2009/List of urban legends.
You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.


It is more a thanks that you closed ti as successful ;) --Barras (talk) 15:20, 9 May 2009 (UTC)Reply



Hey Eptalon, hope you are well. It's time to decide whether you think Abortion should be moved to voting in WP:PGA or just archived as it's had a fair couple of a weeks in the discussion phase. I apologise for not getting round to reviewing it but it's one of those topics which is ordinarily difficult for me to review at work... Best. The Rambling Man (talk) 22:34, 9 May 2009 (UTC)Reply



Can you go to de.wikinews and leave a note for Benutzer:Aholtman, telling her you will help her with the translation and ask her what she would like you to do? Thank you so much! Mike Halterman (talk) 09:16, 10 May 2009 (UTC)Reply

Done. --Eptalon (talk) 09:26, 10 May 2009 (UTC)Reply

Hallo, Eptalon! Danke für Deine Beteiligung bei der Übersetzung am Eurovision-Song-Contest-Artikel. Wenn Du magst, kannst Du natürlich noch mehr übersetzen. (Es hat sich inzwischen auch noch jemand gemeldet, der wohl mit übersetzen würde, und Matthiasb hat auch schon zwei Abschnitte übernommen.) Es wäre sicherlich gut, wenn Du am Ende noch mal drüberschauen würdest, ob da irgendwelche vollkommen "schief" übersetzte Teile drin sind, bevor der Artikel "rausgeht". Viele Grüße --Angela H. (talk) 03:32, 11 May 2009 (UTC)Reply

MRI merge


The articles don't even have talk pages. I find it unlikely that anyone would oppose (it makes sense after all to merge the two). That is just my opinion, and you make the call. Griffinofwales (talk) 21:48, 12 May 2009 (UTC)Reply

I can do the merge in a few hours. It is simple (copy paste the information from MRI, and change the heading to reflect the info on magnetic resonance imaging and you are done). You can do it if you want (but you might be busy too) but I have time in a few hours. Griffinofwales (talk) 21:56, 12 May 2009 (UTC)Reply



Sorry about adding my comment about the Disney Vandal/Bambifan101 to an archived page and creating extra work for you. My bad (blush). Bambifan101, if he's for real, is clearly in need of some sort of professional help and has been a thorn in the side of English for nearly two years. --PMDrive1061 (talk) 18:56, 17 May 2009 (UTC)Reply



Wikipedia:Requests_for_adminship/EVula --Barras (talk) 17:04, 18 May 2009 (UTC)Reply

QD request


Can you please delete this? Thanks, Pmlinediter  Talk 10:15, 19 May 2009 (UTC).Reply

Done...--Eptalon (talk) 10:17, 19 May 2009 (UTC)Reply
Thanks. Pmlinediter  Talk 10:19, 19 May 2009 (UTC)Reply

DYK query


Can you please tell me whether this will be in the next updates? I heard from one user that the same person can't have two DYKs at the same time. Pmlinediter  Talk 12:37, 19 May 2009 (UTC)Reply

Does this answer your question? :). Goblin 13:24, 19 May 2009 (UTC)Reply


How you can see, in recent time I am creating mass of articles, Shappy told me to request the bot flag from you, how I will not flood recent changes. Regards,--AleksA 17:05, 24 May 2009 (UTC)Reply



Enjoy your holiday. MC8 (b · t) 00:43, Thursday May 28 2009 (UTC) (I ♥ Kennedy)

Indeed. Hurry back! I'll hold the fort and add walls of text every so often until you come back. :) Kennedy (talk • changes). (I ♥ MC8) 10:56, 28 May 2009 (UTC)Reply
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